SITE NEWS: We are moving all of our site and company news into a single blog for Sports-Reference.com. We'll tag all PFR content, so you can quickly and easily find the content you want.
Also, our existing PFR blog rss feed will be redirected to the new site's feed.
Pro-Football-Reference.com » Sports Reference
For more from Chase and Jason, check out their work at Football Perspective and The Big Lead.
Shula’s record
Back in August I reviewed the new ESPN Pro Football Encyclopedia. Left on the cutting room floor was my commentary on the Foreword by Joe Theismann. In this half-page piece of work by Theismann, he lists the three records that he "think[s] will never be touched, not with the way the game is played today."
The first is Brett Favre's record for consecutive starts by a quarterback. The second is the Dolphins 17-0 season, which Theismann "guarantees" is safe. Finally he writes this:
The final record I see standing forever is Don Shula's mark of 347 career wins. No one will coach as long as Shula did. There's too much pressure, too much impatience by owners.
When I first read that I did some quick back-of-the-envelope calculations. For some reason Jon Gruden was the first guy to pop into my mind. Gruden has averaged 9 wins per year and he is now 43 years old. At his current rate he's almost 30 years away from the record. Obviously he's a longshot but it's not completely unthinkable.
Now play the same game with Bill Cowher. At his current clip he's 17 or 18 years away from the record, which would mean he would be 66 or 67. I'm not sure Cowher's chances of getting this record are less than, say, Tomlinson's chances of breaking Emmitt Smith's career rushing record. Tomlinson would need to maintain his current pace until he's 33 to catch Emmitt. Is 66 older for a coach than 33 is a for a running back? Possibly, but I'd argue that 10.5 wins per year is an easier pace to maintain at an advanced age than 1500 rushing yards per year is.
I understand Theismann's points about the game being different now than it was in Shula's time. But even if Cowher's relationship with the Steelers goes sour, it's not like he'll have a hard time finding work. It's not clear that he would be able to replicate the same success elsewhere, but it's also not clear that he wouldn't. And even if he only averages 9-and-a-half wins per year instead of 10-and-a-half, he could still retire with the record before or shortly after his 70th birthday.
Think of it this way: what has to happen in order for Cowher not to break the record? Roughly speaking, it would take one or both of the following (and yes, I realize they are somewhat interrelated):
1. He loses the ability to coach at his current level before age 68ish.
2. He loses the desire to coach at his current level before age 68ish.
Now, what does it take for LT to not break Emmitt's record?
1. He loses the ability to play at his current level before age 33.
2. He loses the desire to play at his current level before age 33.
I'd say that in Cowher's case, #2 is as likely as #1, or nearly so. In Tomlinson's case #1 is overwhelmingly more likely than #2. If you want to break a record, desire is the easy part; it's ability that ruins most peoples' attempts to break the all-time rushing record.
In other words, for all the major records, there are many, many people with the desire to break it, but only a few with the skill. Since the playing records are much more dependent on skill, they are in a sense safer.
That said, if you're going to name a record that will never be broken, Shula's record is one that gives you about a 99.9% chance of not looking foolish; by the time it is broken, if ever, everyone will have forgotten that you said it would never be broken. Emmitt's rushing record almost certainly will be broken before Shula's, not necessarily because it's a more difficult feat to match, but because running back careers are shorter than coaching careers, and therefore a whole lot more guys will have the chance to give it a shot. Right now, Cowher is probably the best shot to break Shula's record; a running back who is a high school senior right now could break Emmitt's record before that. Adrian Peterson's son could surpass Emmitt before a guy like Eric Mangini challenges Shula's record.
This entry was posted on Wednesday, December 27th, 2006 at 6:56 pm and is filed under General, History. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

* What happens if they start playing 25 games a season?
* What happens if games become 90 minutes long?
* What happens if rule changes favor the running game, because the league gets a bug in its bonnet that more rushing means more revenue somehow?
* What happens if sports medicine makes people's careers last 30 years?
* What happens when the life expectancy becomes 120 and people coach until they're 100?
* What happens when the field becomes twice as big?
* What happens when there are 100 teams instead of 32?
It is easy to imagine the game will always be the way it is today, but that is not necessarily realistic. No record is unbreakable.
==
Someone once asked Marv Levy how rules could be changed to make football higher scoring. He said they could make touchdowns worth 60 points and field goals worth 30.
"Three records that will never be touched."
No mention of John Unitas's 47 consecutive games with TD passes?
I did a back-of-the-envelope on that one and it looks to me like the chances of it being broken are *way* less than of Gruden or Cowher or somebody breaking that wins record -- and certainly way less than some team having a 17-0 or 19-0 season someday. Up there with DiMaggio's batting streak. Even with the liberalization of the passing rules, nobody else has topped 36 in 46 years and counting.
This seems another example of a big difference between football and baseball cultures. Baseball people have great respect for records that are 50, 70, even 100 years old. Most football people think all the greatest records that matter are something they saw on TV. Theismann was a QB himself and the QB TD-pass record doesn't occur even to him.
What if Tom Landry comes out of retirement?
Shula averaged 9.9 regular season wins per season for his career. Half of his coaching career was during a 14-game season. Pretty amazing. He won 10+ games 20 times! He was 33 for his first head coaching job, and won his 328th (and final) regular season game at age 65. At his current pace, Bill Cowher could catch Shula when he is 67, so that's not too far off Shula's pace.
Even Eric Mangini (age 35) does not project to catch Shula by age 65 if you assume 10 wins this season, and continuing that pace the rest of his career.
Schottenheimer needs about 14 more years (age 77) to catch Shula. Shanahan needs 21 years (age 75). Holmgren needs 19 years (age 77). Jeff Fisher needs 28 years (age 76).
Owner patience is one reason that this record will be tough to beat. But that was never really a problem for Shula. His first losing season was his 14th year. I think any coach who wins at least 10 games in 10 of his first 13 seasons is going to garner a lot of goodwill from the owners and be able to overcome a couple of losing seasons.
Cowher has that kind of goodwill, especially in Pittsburgh. How many bad seasons in a row would he have to have to get fired? 4?
But, as usual, I think parity is one of the biggest obstacles towards anybody catching Shula. It's just very difficult to win 9-10 regular season games every year.
Doug,
How come you don't have a "Coaches" link in the quick index at the top?
I find it interesting that Theissman thinks that Brett Favre's consecutive games(236, 256 including playoffs) started record is going to hold up. According to wikipedia, Peyton Manning has started 142 consecutive games, so he would need to start every game for the next 6 years to break the record, assuming Favre retires at the end of this year. That doesn't sound impossible to me.
Did anyone notice that all three of the "unbreakable records" are not dependent on any one player. Meaning, these are not records that can be broken by some amazing talent coming around and shattering the record. These are all records of longevity. Even the 17-0 record is not dependent on one player being good enough to break the record. I would say that even the best team ever in football probably wouldnt break the 17-0 record.
Whether these records are broken or not is not something I care so much about. I want to know if someone will challenge some of Jerry Rice's records. Or if someone will break Peyton's TD record. Those are the records that are interesting to me.
Brett Favre's concecutive starts is dependent on one player. I guess you are referring to single game records or single season records?
I think MO's point with the Favre record is that no matter how durable you are, it only takes one freak play to end it. Even an Iron-Man can't play with a broken leg. So to that extent you are dependent on luck.
I think the point that anything other than a long term career record being "unbreakable" isnt really a point at all.
ABW (#7),
I agree completely, and that was my first thought as well. But the funny thing is, Theismann used that exact same calculation as evidence of the unbreakability of Favre's record. I don't have the quote in front of me, but it was something like, "just to put in perspective how amazing this is, Peyton Manning would have to start every game for the next SIX YEARS just to tie it." I sure wouldn't bet too much against that.
manning sucks. he will miss half of next season. go kitna.
My point was that none of these records are stats records. I think that all these records are amazing and Theisman is possibly right that they wont be broken but it's not like a record where someone put up amazing stats over a game, season, or career. I think a record like Jerry Rice's 208 career TD's or if anyone will break 300 yards rushing in a game are records that can be debated whether it will be broken.
Its like if I said that Tony Dorsett's record of longest run from scrimmage will never be broken. It wont be broken but I am not really saying anything of value. Thats how I look at those 3 "unbreakable" records.
Here's my guess----Bart Starr's Record for HIGHEST PASSER RATING in the Post-season. Nobody will ever match or beat Starr's Rating of 104.8 for 10 games in the Playoffs. Nobody will be that consistently great under that much pressure ever again. But, you do have to also admire and give alot of credit to Montana and Bradshaw for their great play in their 4 S.B.'s----Montana--Rating of 127.8 and Bradshaw's Rating of 112.8. Those 3 were the BEST when under extreme pressure, but Tom Brady is moving up, in-spite of '07.
Mathematically speaking, and without a change in rules as far as field dimensions (as in the CFL) there are some records that will never be broken, they could only be tied.
Longest Punt: 98 yards. Even if the ball is placed one millimeter from the punting team’s endzone, it would be rounded to the 1 yard for the purposes of recordkeeping. If downed 1 millimeter from the receiver’s endzone, it would be rounded to the 1 yard line for the purposes of recordkeeping. It has been done once. Steve O'Neal, N.Y. Jets vs. Denver, Sept. 21, 1969. (I leave out the same possibility for kickoffs, which could only be done after the kicking team had been assessed an infinite number of penalties before kicking, starting from nearly their own endzone.)
Longest Scoring Pass/Run/Receiving play: 99 yards. These would fall under the same constraints as punting, but at only one end.
The rushing record has been reached once by Tony Dorsett, Dallas vs. Minnesota, Jan. 3, 1983 (TD).
The maximum record for passing (and receiving) has been reached many times:
Frank Filchock (to Farkas), Washington vs. Pittsburgh, Oct. 15, 1939
George Izo (to Mitchell), Washington vs. Cleveland, Sept. 15, 1963
Karl Sweetan (to Studstill), Detroit vs. Baltimore, Oct. 16, 1966
Sonny Jurgensen (to Allen), Washington vs. Chicago, Sept. 15, 1968
Jim Plunkett (to Branch), L.A. Raiders vs. Washington, Oct. 2, 1983
Ron Jaworski (to Quick), Philadelphia vs. Atlanta, Nov. 10, 1985
Stan Humphries (to Martin), San Diego vs. Seattle, Sept. 18, 1994
Brett Favre (to Brooks), Green Bay vs. Chicago, Sept. 11, 1995
Trent Green (to Boerigter), Kansas City vs. San Diego, Dec. 22, 2002
Jeff Garcia (to Davis), Cleveland vs. Cincinnati, Oct. 17, 2004
Longest Non-Scoring Pass/Run/Receiving play: 98 yards. These would fall under the same constraints as punting.
The rushing record has never been reached.
The passing record has been reached once:
Jim Hart (to Moore), St. Louis vs. Los Angeles, Dec. 10, 1972 (no TD)
Longest Scoring Punt/Kickoff/Interception Return: 109 yards. Any of these would be recorded after game film had been reviewed and fall under the same rounding constraints as would happen in punting. So far, no player has reached the maximum.
Longest Non-Scoring Punt/Kickoff/Interception Return: 108 yards. Any of these would be recorded after game film had been reviewed and fall under the same rounding constraints as would happen in punting. So far, no player has reached the maximum.